Ethos, ya sabemos el precio

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ManuelJ
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Mensajepor ManuelJ » 05 Sep 2007, 17:25

Por cierto, con el "cambio a Euros", por llamarlo de alguna manera se queda en 679€.

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andresmatorral
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Mensajepor andresmatorral » 05 Sep 2007, 22:17

Pues no os olvideis de darnos vuestras opiniones. Con respecto a las opiniones anteriores como colofón tengo que decir que todo lo dicho, al menos por mi parte, tiene que ver con el hecho de que no tengo un presupuesto ilimitado, ni siquiera olgado... vamos que yo estimo que ni siquiera digno de mencionar en ninguna parte, desde ese punto de vista hablo de que más de 68º es excesivo. Si tuviera el dinero, y no refiero a capital infinito, sino, que pudiera ahorrar de forma razonable ese dinero tendria todos mis oculares de 82º y el Ethos en el punto de mira; por eso no estimo una tonteria lo de los grados de más ni me parece una pijada.
Desde la sana envidia espero las criticas al ocular a los felices poseedores del mismo.

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ManuelJ
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Mensajepor ManuelJ » 05 Sep 2007, 22:34

andresmatorral escribió:Pues no os olvideis de darnos vuestras opiniones. Con respecto a las opiniones anteriores como colofón tengo que decir que todo lo dicho, al menos por mi parte, tiene que ver con el hecho de que no tengo un presupuesto ilimitado, ni siquiera olgado... vamos que yo estimo que ni siquiera digno de mencionar en ninguna parte, desde ese punto de vista hablo de que más de 68º es excesivo. Si tuviera el dinero, y no refiero a capital infinito, sino, que pudiera ahorrar de forma razonable ese dinero tendria todos mis oculares de 82º y el Ethos en el punto de mira; por eso no estimo una tonteria lo de los grados de más ni me parece una pijada.
Desde la sana envidia espero las criticas al ocular a los felices poseedores del mismo.


En cambio a mi 68º me da la sensacion de estar mirando por un tunel. Y eso que dispongo de oculares de 30º, pero para observaciones muy especificas.

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betelgeuse_
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Mensajepor betelgeuse_ » 06 Sep 2007, 01:34

ya te digo Manu acabo de llegar del monte y he estado observando la nebulosa Dumbel con nagler 17mm 2" y taka fs 102 y vamos y el que no note la diferencia pues mejor pa el, que no se va a gastar los duros, eso si la sensacion de cercania que te da esos 82º .... merece esos euros de mas aunque entiendo que cada uno sabe hasta donde tiene que llegar con su aficion

por cierto con dumbell he hecho mi primer autoguiado!!!!!! y me he quedado de una agusto...... :D ya os enseñare la foto me ha quedado mas bonica..... ahora me voy a la piltra... con todos esos luceros todavia chispeando en la retina

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Mensajepor Guest » 06 Sep 2007, 08:37

Hombre, tanto como mirar por un tunel, a mi los 70º de los XW no me dan ninguna sensación de tunel.

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ManuelJ
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Mensajepor ManuelJ » 06 Sep 2007, 09:25

abutu escribió:Hombre, tanto como mirar por un tunel, a mi los 70º de los XW no me dan ninguna sensación de tunel.


Es que son las malas costumbres, espero no acostumbrarme a los 100º, por que sino ya me contaras que hago con los Naglers!

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nanitomio
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TV Ethos 13 mm

Mensajepor nanitomio » 06 Sep 2007, 09:33

Hola a todos :D . Mi amigo Roy Diffrent no tiene inconveniente en que se haga pública nuestra correspondencia privada en relacion al Ethos y a continuacion os los expongo por si os sirven de utilidad. Saludos.

De: Roy Diffrent
Enviado el: mar 21/08/2007 1:10
Para: Coca Pérez, Santiago
Asunto: New 100 degree eyepiece at Stellafane

Hi Santi,

Recently returned from Stellafane where Al Nagler was showing prototypes of the new Ethos eyepiece. I met the optical designer, Paul Dellechiaie, and found that we had unknowingly been setting up next to his usual campsite at Stellafane for several years -- Just another Stellafaner so far as we knew. They were showing two of the five initial prototypes with Televue 4-inch refractors. Both of the prototypes were identical in optical configuration -- And they said that was also the optical design for production. Only one of the two was the final mechanical configuration. But the differences were very minor -- The largest difference pointed out was that the Nagler-style rubber eyecup is easier to flip up on the final version because a shoulder in the metal directly under the eyecup was eliminated. The barrel is both 2 inch and 1-1/4.

Approaching this eyepiece for the first time, I wondered how the full 100-degree field could somehow appear 15 mm away, more than half an inch, per the Televue press release. I couldn't measure that, of course, although part of the field did become visible at maybe a finger-width away. So I ventured closer. Finally, with my eyebrow in contact with the rubber eyecup, I saw part of the very wide field stop. Careful positioning of my eye was necessary to see the entire field. With my eye centered, I found that when the unfolded eyecup touched above and below my eye, the entire field was just visible. Pushing in a bit closer than that made the field start to disappear from the center outward. So there appears to be a pretty small sweet spot for seeing everything with this one. I did not try eyeglasses, but those who must wear them for observing may well have difficulty in getting their money's worth from this eyepiece.

One of my reference books describes simulating the view through wide field eyepieces by looking through lengths of cardboard tubing, cut from paper towel or toilet paper rolls -- the shorter the length of tube, the wider the field seen when looking through it. But that simulation fails completely with this eyepiece. Instead, for the Ethos, try looking through a hole in a thin flat plate. I thought the field was actually wider than 100 degrees, but Paul D. said it had been measured.

One might think that another 18 degrees added to the field of an 82-degree Nagler wouldn't make that much of a difference. After all, that's just 9 degrees in every field direction. But Al pointed out that with that increase, the field area increases by over 50%. Maybe Al was being modest -- It's fairly easy to calculate that for a flat field, the increased area is very nearly 88%! That correlates much closer to my perceived WOW-factor. Or, considered another way, the field with the Ethos is about the same as a Nagler 16 mm, but with the magnification of a 13 mm. It is a considerable improvement in FOV over Naglers -- The peripheral view when looking straight ahead is nearly all you can possibly see.

My first night time view was on Jupiter through Paul D's telescope. As I slewed the image of the planet and four moons back and forth from side to side across the field, I saw no obvious change in colors on/around the planet, and no change in relative spacing between the moons. The circular shape of the planet did not noticeably change.

Al provided a view of the M24 star cloud in the Milky Way. Stars covered the field as far as I could see in every direction, and the field stop was barely detectable against the dark sky. Stars were almost perfect pinpoints out to the field edge, very similar to current Naglers. That view was stunning. Naglers were supposed to be the "space-walk experience". This is far better.

Paul D. couldn't tell me much about what's to come, although he did confirm that this is just the start of a new series. He couldn't say whether the design came from an incremental improvement over Naglers, or if it was totally new, and I still have no clue how many optical elements are in the eyepiece. He did say that the effort involved in developing the optical design was less than that involved in coming up with the name, Ethos. And he is very proud of his creation. Both Paul and Al said availability was early Fall. Stellafane even gave away one as a raffle prize, to be delivered.

Roy

----- Original Message -----
From: "Coca Pérez, Santiago"
To: Roy Diffrient
Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2007 4:02 AM
Subject: RE: New 100 degree eyepiece at Stellafane

Hello Roy,

thanks you very much for your extensive report about your Stellafane experience. It is a real chance to me knowing your first impressions about the Ethos eyepiece, specially when I am at thousands of milles from Stellafane.
I am impressed about your first feelings about the Ethos eyepiece. Really a 100 degrees field in a 13 mm eyepiece is a great improvement over the traditional Nagler's field. It is not easy to me thinking about the field of a Nagler 16 mm, but with the magnification of a 13 mm. I suppose that this will be an impresive window to see galaxy groups.
I am very happy you had contacted Al and its optical designer Paul. Although my optical knowledge is very limited, I imagine the tremendous dificulties to eliminate glass distortions, colour aberrations and other. Will the Ethos require a Paracorr when used through a fast reflector instead a long focal ratio refractor?
I am very happy when consider the possibility of Ethos to be the first element of a new Nagler´s serie. Perhaps could be able a 9 or 7 mm, 100º Ethos in a near future?
Best wishes.
Santi


De: Roy Diffrent
Para: Coca Pérez, Santiago
Asunto: New 100 degree eyepiece at Stellafane

I wish you could have been there, Santi, to see it for yourself. Yes, the Ethos will need a Paracorr even more than does a Nagler 16, because the higher magnification of the 13 mm will probably make the coma a little more apparent if you look for it. But the increased coma will be further from the field center, out at the field edge. More good questions: Will the Ethos 13 reach focus in our telescopes without any modifications, and how do we adjust the Paracorr for it? We have no answers, and no price, for now.

It's just a guess at this point what will come next -- The next one may well be a 9 or 7 mm. This is a larger eyepiece than the current Nagler 13, so an Ethos 20 or 32 might be too much larger and more difficult (and expensive!), and so may come later, if at all. But the next one might also be a 16 mm with the field of a Nagler 20.


Roy

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betelgeuse_
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Mensajepor betelgeuse_ » 06 Sep 2007, 09:33

Es que son las malas costumbres, espero no acostumbrarme a los 100º, por que sino ya me contaras que hago con los Naglers![/quote]

jejejeje.... pues como vayan bien los ETHOS vas a ver que pronto sacan toda la gama de distancias focales......

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ManuelJ
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Mensajepor ManuelJ » 06 Sep 2007, 10:06

Gracias nanitomio. Lo mas importante del Ethos ya no es su gran campo, su correccion bestial... sino su pupila de salida, que es perfecta para cielo profundo para mis instrumentos.

Lo unico que me fastidia es el incremento del 50% del precio en las tiendas españolas, que me parece un robo a mano armada.

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Mensajepor Guest » 06 Sep 2007, 11:35

Hola compañeros, pues aqui uno que padece graditis aguda, y tiene uno encargado en usa, me va a salir en 620 dolares yankies, esperemos que no pase aduana, aunque estoy en lista de espera.

SALUDOS. :wink:

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